MadAbbott Posted April 27, 2016 Share Posted April 27, 2016 Hoping vekked or another juggling badass can help out here. I try to give everything a good go before asking for help but have to concede this has got me beat... 5:14 - 5:16, a kind of chase movement but he only doubles the kicks, not every sound which it's what's puzzling me.. the track has 4 stab sounds at this point with a kick in between each....he gets 5 stabs in total and doubles only the kicks in between each. I can kind of do it for 2 stabs (ie stab kick kick stab kick kick) but it's very hit and miss, there's just not enough space between the stab and kick to comfortably put the other in between and then rewind to follow with a stab sound on the same side as you're putting in the 2nd kick...he does it twice on this video flawlessly both times, there's got to be an easy technique i'm missing, it seems way too hard to catch mid routine. A chase ie one slightly ahead of the other makes sense but every variation i'm trying is doubling up the stab sound... Someone pls put me out of my misery!!Unbelievable routine from the man of the moment by the way .... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 I learned a lot back in the day from watching Shure 101 on VHS. I also have the exact track Rob's using if that helps. Reading what you wrote above, it sounds like you're trying to drop in the second kick each time, but it's really the fader that does most of the work. Am I right? I'm not sure I can explain it in text but I can show you. Do you ever use Vekked's Tinychat room (or the DV TinyChat room lol)? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vekked Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 He's doing basic tripling/chasing but the sample makes it sounds more interesting. I just tried it and if you start on the kick directly after the first stab and just do tripling from there, that's all he's doing. He starts it a bit non-standard, so he starts on the stab on the right, then brings it back to the kick directly after the stab and does tripling through the rest. So typically you would start tripling from the first beat, but he has like a 2 beat lead-in and triples from the kick so that when he does the pause/hit me at the end, it's a full 8 beat pattern and lands on beat when the beat drops. If you're not familiar with tripling (which is the basis of the pattern, so it's pretty key), basically it's chasing except you're doing triple the fader movements between sides. Instead of just going left->right when you switch decks, you go left->right->left->right, and vise versa. If you're chasing in perfect triplets (which is the swing your typical chase or breakdown should have), each fader movement will add a note from the side record it goes to. So you get 3 notes for each time you switch records instead of 1. Total Eclipse and Akakabe are pretty famous for this, and a bunch of guys still somehow win battles doing it today b/c people sucks and juggle worse than 20 years ago. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadAbbott Posted April 28, 2016 Author Share Posted April 28, 2016 I learned a lot back in the day from watching Shure 101 on VHS. I also have the exact track Rob's using if that helps. Reading what you wrote above, it sounds like you're trying to drop in the second kick each time, but it's different from tripling, because it's really the fader that does most of the work. Am I right? I'm not sure I can explain it in text but I can show you. Hey Broke, yeah I got that VHS too but only remember the J-Rocc bits with breakdown of the quiet storm / large pro routine to be honest, must have watched that a hundred times though!I never really watched rob's stuff back in the day and had that same "I wanna do that" reaction but I've got a bit of a "second wind" when it comes to juggling and quite enjoying just doing something other than scratching for a bit and learning techniques I should have got down years ago. I did always appreciate he was very big on keeping things musical and in time and his routines were always very well rehearsed and clean though.Or maybe he just talked too much on that clip and I skipped past it!No worries, I found the track it's a bonus beat one on the jungle groove album right (on of the best ever!), took me a while to realise the "hit me" wasn't on the original track! Vekked - awesome, really appreciate the detailed tips, I will work on this after work and see if it falls into place for me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 No worries, I found the track it's a bonus beat one on the jungle groove album right (on of the best ever!), took me a while to realise the "hit me" wasn't on the original track! It's TD - Feelin' James (basically Coldcut and Steinski if I remember correctly) PM me if you need the track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadAbbott Posted April 28, 2016 Author Share Posted April 28, 2016 No worries, I found the track it's a bonus beat one on the jungle groove album right (on of the best ever!), took me a while to realise the "hit me" wasn't on the original track!It's LD - Feelin' James (basically Coldcut and Steinski if I remember correctly) Oh I'll have to track that one down - I thought it was this at 0:41, maybe that's why mine was off!..I was watching his stickers and was thinking sounds weren't landing where they should when I did it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeClockwork Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Notice how Rob only brings the fader into the middle when he's tripling. If you want it to sound super tight, you can take the fader all the way to the opposite side and back when you're tripling. Klever does it at the end of his Luda juggle, at 5:06: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Sorry that should have been TD, not LD. Been watching to much Curb... https://youtu.be/HeYJB2by1qM?t=2m11s 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadAbbott Posted April 28, 2016 Author Share Posted April 28, 2016 Notice how Rob only brings the fader into the middle when he's tripling. If you want it to sound super tight, you can take the fader all the way to the opposite side and back when you're tripling. nice one Joe, yeah I did notice that! Will watch Klever now, remember that fresh "more dusty than digital" tee! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Oh I'll have to track that one down - I thought it was this at 0:41, maybe that's why mine was off!..I was watching his stickers and was thinking sounds weren't landing where they should when I did it! That's definitely the part that was sampled, but if you use Feelin' James you'll find it easier to replicate what Rob's doing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadAbbott Posted April 28, 2016 Author Share Posted April 28, 2016 Oh I'll have to track that one down - I thought it was this at 0:41, maybe that's why mine was off!..I was watching his stickers and was thinking sounds weren't landing where they should when I did it!That's definitely the part that was sampled, but if you use Feelin' James you'll find it easier to replicate what Rob's doing. oh right, if it's slower, it'll definitely be easier! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GNOD Posted April 28, 2016 Share Posted April 28, 2016 Still have 2 copies of Feelin James. I could do a Vinyl rip? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadAbbott Posted April 28, 2016 Author Share Posted April 28, 2016 Still have 2 copies of Feelin James. I could do a Vinyl rip? Very kind! Don't worry though found a copy in 320kbps http://www.1994hiphop.com/2014/12/coldcut-steinski-no-rights-given-or-implied-cd-1993-flac-320-kbps/#more-17856 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadAbbott Posted April 29, 2016 Author Share Posted April 29, 2016 He's doing basic tripling/chasing but the sample makes it sounds more interesting. I just tried it and if you start on the kick directly after the first stab and just do tripling from there, that's all he's doing. He starts it a bit non-standard, so he starts on the stab on the right, then brings it back to the kick directly after the stab and does tripling through the rest. So typically you would start tripling from the first beat, but he has like a 2 beat lead-in and triples from the kick so that when he does the pause/hit me at the end, it's a full 8 beat pattern and lands on beat when the beat drops. If you're not familiar with tripling (which is the basis of the pattern, so it's pretty key), basically it's chasing except you're doing triple the fader movements between sides. Instead of just going left->right when you switch decks, you go left->right->left->right, and vise versa. If you're chasing in perfect triplets (which is the swing your typical chase or breakdown should have), each fader movement will add a note from the side record it goes to. So you get 3 notes for each time you switch records instead of 1. Total Eclipse and Akakabe are pretty famous for this, and a bunch of guys still somehow win battles doing it today b/c people sucks and juggle worse than 20 years ago. Alright, hopefully I got it now....having trouble catching it cleanly ( I think I completely miss one stab sound here but nothing else I did to post was any better), hopefully that will come with practise. Incidentally this is with my pitch right down as slow as possible (as one is a 1200), so I'm still a bit perplexed as to how Rob's catching them cleanly at normal speed.... I'm starting here with the first stab on my left deck going to the first kick (after the first stab) on the right, that's about the only way I got a similar sounding technique... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vekked Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 Alright, hopefully I got it now....having trouble catching it cleanly ( I think I completely miss one stab sound here but nothing else I did to post was any better), hopefully that will come with practise. Incidentally this is with my pitch right down as slow as possible (as one is a 1200), so I'm still a bit perplexed as to how Rob's catching them cleanly at normal speed.... I'm starting here with the first stab on my left deck going to the first kick (after the first stab) on the right, that's about the only way I got a similar sounding technique... Yea that sounds basically on point, just needs to be cleaner. The reason he's starting/ending a bit differently is because in the contexts of the routine he goes right into it from the right record playing into the stab, then adds the pause on the left to keep it on beat. So he's tripling for like 5-6 beats and adding a beat at the beginning and end to make it an 8 beat pattern so it makes sense musically. But for the raw technique I think you have it. Also as for Rob catching them cleanly, he's not really tripling thaaat fast in the video, it's not slow either, but not crazy difficult to do that speed if you clean up your triples. Are you able to do triples through a beat for 1-2 minutes straight? You should be comfortable enough just tripling for an indefinite amount of time, without even looking (stickers don't really matter for chases). If you can do that at the tempo of the Funky Drummer beat, he is using Reprise btw, then you should be able to do them like Rob. The only tricky part is going straight into them cleanly from nothing, whereas if you do them for a minute say, you can adjust and clean them up if they're sloppy for a couple bars. And Joe is right, in general you want to move your fader over all the way. On a lot of hip-hop beats and breaks that are pretty sparse, you won't hear much of a different, but if you're using something with long notes that go multiple beats it'll sound really sloppy if you don't cross the fader over all the way to cut off the other tracks. If you're doing turbo speed stuff maybe it makes sense not to go the full distance but even for my fastest stuff I still go all the way over. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 29, 2016 Share Posted April 29, 2016 Yeah like Vekked was saying, initially you might be looking at where the sticker is, but the key to tripling for longer than a couple of bars is to get the feel for how fast your hands move in relation to the beat so that you can do it without looking down at the records. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadAbbott Posted April 30, 2016 Author Share Posted April 30, 2016 Alright, hopefully I got it now....having trouble catching it cleanly ( I think I completely miss one stab sound here but nothing else I did to post was any better), hopefully that will come with practise. Incidentally this is with my pitch right down as slow as possible (as one is a 1200), so I'm still a bit perplexed as to how Rob's catching them cleanly at normal speed.... I'm starting here with the first stab on my left deck going to the first kick (after the first stab) on the right, that's about the only way I got a similar sounding technique... Are you able to do triples through a beat for 1-2 minutes straight? You should be comfortable enough just tripling for an indefinite amount of time, without even looking (stickers don't really matter for chases). If you can do that at the tempo of the Funky Drummer beat, he is using Reprise btw, then you should be able to do them like Rob. The only tricky part is going straight into them cleanly from nothing, whereas if you do them for a minute say, you can adjust and clean them up if they're sloppy for a couple bars. Really appreciate the input guys! Do you mean what Ruftone is doing at 0:50 secs here for example - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bMj9N8yz7I#t=0m50s I'm quite comfortable with chasers with pauses normally but not clean enough doubling up the fader movements, I'll catch the sounds maybe only one in every 4 or 5 attempts say. Agreed no need to look at stickers for those... If what Rob is doing is just based on these chasers that's relatively straightforward then, maybe as you say the sounds he's using make it sound more interesting. The arm movements are very similar though. I hadn't really thought about it ever but not considered this as tripling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.