djdiggla Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 I was thinking maybe ISP Vs. Da Klams Uv Deth (1997). The X-Men's X-Pressions came out September of the same year too. Those were the first two I really heard. Klamz felt more revolutionary but both were on that "turntable band" steez. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 I can't think of an actual album that was released earlier than X-Pressions. The ISP 12" was a recording of the routine they did when battling X-Men in 1996, so I wouldn't count that as it's not an album. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdiggla Posted December 1, 2020 Author Share Posted December 1, 2020 Oh that's a good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrblast Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Attack of the Wildstyle Beat Freaks in 1995? Did Dave the Ruf release any turntablist lps earlier than that? That's a dope lp, still listen to it these days. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrblast Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 Actually Return of the DJ vol 1 was 95 also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 7 hours ago, mrblast said: Attack of the Wildstyle Beat Freaks I discounted ROTJ because of it being a compilation, but this surely counts. I'd completely forgotten it existed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neks Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 this topic reminded me of this article about the same question: https://aspirinregimen.substack.com/p/how-the-first-turntablist-album-was-9aa Now it's the first time I've heard of that album and I think the article had to twist the definition of a turntablist album in order to give this LP the title. Interesting take nonetheless. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdiggla Posted December 2, 2020 Author Share Posted December 2, 2020 9 hours ago, mrblast said: Attack of the Wildstyle Beat Freaks in 1995? Did Dave the Ruf release any turntablist lps earlier than that? That's a dope lp, still listen to it these days. Man, I don't know that one. Good call on ROTDJ... I didn't realize it was prior.... compilation tho like Steve said which doesn't discount it but I was more interested in a group or individual LP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdiggla Posted December 2, 2020 Author Share Posted December 2, 2020 1 hour ago, neks said: this topic reminded me of this article about the same question: https://aspirinregimen.substack.com/p/how-the-first-turntablist-album-was-9aa Now it's the first time I've heard of that album and I think the article had to twist the definition of a turntablist album in order to give this LP the title. Interesting take nonetheless. Yeah that's an interesting one... got an argument there... it certainly depends on how you are going to define it. I've heard that album and may even have it... it was ok. Wasn't a regular listen for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zetrik Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 I still have a copy of Fathomless which also came out in 98 , that was Faust, Shortee, and Craze basically attempting a scratch band project, I actually got to see this live in town at Electric Lounge ! ...apparently Craze now hates all that stuff he did back then smh 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkei Posted December 2, 2020 Share Posted December 2, 2020 To me turntablism is all live performed music via a scratchmixer, turntable and vinyl, no multitrack (like Faust on his LP) and/or using beats made on a sampler (like Wavetwister). So maybee Invasion of the Octopus people was the 1st track and the beatjunkies live performance of Ds Phantazmagorea LP (which was produced with multitracks) must be the first album entirely performed live (outside of battling)...if my interpretation would count and my gibbergabber would make any sense... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdiggla Posted December 3, 2020 Author Share Posted December 3, 2020 20 hours ago, zetrik said: I still have a copy of Fathomless which also came out in 98 , that was Faust, Shortee, and Craze basically attempting a scratch band project, I actually got to see this live in town at Electric Lounge ! ...apparently Craze now hates all that stuff he did back then smh Crazy. I'd be interested to hear that album if you get a chance to up it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdiggla Posted December 3, 2020 Author Share Posted December 3, 2020 20 hours ago, arkei said: To me turntablism is all live performed music via a scratchmixer, turntable and vinyl, no multitrack (like Faust on his LP) and/or using beats made on a sampler (like Wavetwister). So maybee Invasion of the Octopus people was the 1st track and the beatjunkies live performance of Ds Phantazmagorea LP (which was produced with multitracks) must be the first album entirely performed live (outside of battling)...if my interpretation would count and my gibbergabber would make any sense... Ha! Arkei going super hardliner! Not even multi-track! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam Burglar Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 19 hours ago, arkei said: To me turntablism is all live performed music via a scratchmixer, turntable and vinyl, no multitrack (like Faust on his LP) and/or using beats made on a sampler (like Wavetwister). So maybee Invasion of the Octopus people was the 1st track and the beatjunkies live performance of Ds Phantazmagorea LP (which was produced with multitracks) must be the first album entirely performed live (outside of battling)...if my interpretation would count and my gibbergabber would make any sense... "Turntablist" album vs. "Scratch Composition" album is different for me. For me a "Scratch Composition" album is where all the elements are straight up composed on the turntable using scratching/juggling. I think Phataz would take the title for there. I see a "Turntablist" album as being broader and basically just meaning containing heavy amounts of turntable elements. So, I would consider "Wave Twisters" a "turntablist" album that has some "Scratch Composition" tracks on it. I would consider Grandmaster Flash "Adventures on the Wheels of Steel" a "turntablist" song. I'm trying to think of who might have done a full album prior to the Faust one that qualifies. I'm not all that familiar with "Fathomless" but it doesn't sound like all those drums are scratched. To go on a little tangent here. In either category, I think you'd be hard pressed to find any studio album that doesn't use multi-tracking/looping/punch-ins, effects, etc. I've thought about the use of studio tools in scratch composition a lot and had back and forth with D-Styles and other turntablists about it. I've come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter as much as I once thought it did. It almost seems like a non-issue to a lot of people. The main thing is, if you ever plan to perform the album live, you need to keep that in mind when recording so that you can reasonably do that. If the album/track is so studio heavy that it would be virtually impossible to perform live, then that concern goes out the window and it's purely about creating the sound you want. For example, there are tracks on Phantaz that they had to strip down for live performance. On the other hand, ISP's 13th Floor was created with the live performance in mind. Or, if you do like the DJ band thing, then it's more straight forward because you're pretty much composing based on the musicians in the room. However, even if you plan to perform live, you're still going to be using studio tools on the album. If you want tight drums, chances are you will not be trying to do drum the whole track non-stop in one take and doing it again and again until you get it right. You're going to be copying, pasting, etc., and probably looping if you want a track to sound like a golden era hip hop cut. I don't see it as "cheating" as much as I once did. All musicians use studio tools when making records. The Beatles could not perform Sgt. Peppers live and make it sound like the record. So yeah, blah, blah blah. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkei Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 Perfectly d'accord with you Jam. So that Scratch Composition hors d'oeuvre called Phantazmagorea was performed live by the Scratch Performers (the Ruck used to have an article about that on Asis) of the Beatjunkies and the Scratch-Composer/Performer D-Styles. Turntablism in that sense isen't even aboard. Doesn't mean that Turntablist cannot be Scratch-Composers and/or Scratch Performers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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