Steve Posted April 8, 2019 Share Posted April 8, 2019 If an artist has been accused of some serious misdeeds - or even convicted of such things - does that affect how you enjoy their music? Does it affect you using their music in a mix or playing it at a gig? If there's a line, where do you draw it? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 If an artist has been accused of some serious misdeeds - or even convicted of such things - does that affect how you enjoy their music? Does it affect you using their music in a mix or playing it at a gig? If there's a line, where do you draw it? To be honest, it depends on who it is, what they did and how good their music is. R Kelly and Michael Jackson have been in the news recently, but to me it was just more of the same thing i.e. we'd already been through all of this with both of them (previous court cases etc) and my personal opinion has always been that are both guilty of what they are alleged to have done, be it recently or in the past. Has that stopped me playing R Kelly? Recently, yes it has. But I only ever played Ignition (Remix). It's always been a guilty pleasure that I hated to admit I liked, because like I said, to me R Kelly has been a creepy sex pest and batshit crazy since day one. Oh and the video for Real Talk remains one of the greatest videos on YouTube. But the rest of his catalogue is garbage anyway, so it's no big loss to me. I wouldn't ever listen to Michael Jackson at home or in the car or whatever, but as a DJ it's highly likely that I'm going to keep playing his early stuff whether I like it or not (depending on the occasion). Again, the recent doco didn't change my opinion of him, I always felt he was a creepy weirdo and probable sex pest, so if I was going to boycott playing MJ I would've have done it ages ago. So there's obviously a massive double standard there. Plus, I have never stopped playing Rick James or James Brown. Only last year I found about MC Tee and TBH that has affected the way I feel about listening to and playing Mantronix. But their early stuff had such a massive influence on me musically that I can't just 'cancel' them, as the young folks say. I cut up that 'funky dope' sample nearly every time I scratch (although I'm not sure that was MC Tee doing that vocal intro). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHouse Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Steve, are you speaking specifically about Milli Vanilli? Asking for a friend. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arkei Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 If the hamburger-incident wouldn't have taken place, then I'd still be playing "Looking for Freedom" by the Hoff. But everything changed after that... It's difficult. I try to ban everything, when the artist pulled a Africa Bambaatta. But it's difficult if a there's a lot of nostalgia with a specific artists work. I used to really dig Rapper's Delight and was always playing that tune with my little brother (it was on a shitty disco compilation that I still have). So finding out they were biting the lyrics let a sore taste, but it's not as a bad as what others did. And James Brown. I grew up on that ish only to find out afterwards what he and his wive did to that poor woman... I guess the harder the crime the more difficult, ignoring the facts... So I try to ban/ignore them 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Rock Well Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Speaking from the perspective of someone selling the music to the feral* public. Everythings absolutely fine unless you mess with kids basically. Much of it is probably ignorance, but there are some pretty damn unpleasant people who sell regardless. When it comes the child molesters its very much related to how good the music is too. For most Michael Jackson fans, hed have to be alive and caught in the act them personally for anyone to see a problem there. And nobody is vaguely concerned that he was a black man who actively spent his time and money turning himself white. Hes just a very unique case of vitaligo apparently... a skin condition that removed all his natural features. You couldnt make it up! Also, even for the nonces, there are levels. Sure Jimmy Page was publically engaged to 14 year old Lori Maddox but he was in Led Zeppelin, wasnt black or gay and hasnt had any documentaries made about his past relationships. Plus old rockers pretty much a get a free pass for everything. I dunno, I sound accusatory, but I have music I love by murderers, rapists, wife beaters, pimps and so forth. On the whole I think the art should be detached, if only because there would be a lot of good music gone forever. But then again I still bin the Gary Glitter records that turn up in collections, so maybe Im as bad as anyone else? *i wrote general but autocorrect had a more accurate word 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBearOne8III Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 I dunno, I sound accusatory, but I have music I love by murderers, rapists, wife beaters, pimps and so forth. On the whole I think the art should be detached, if only because there would be a lot of good music gone forever. This pretty much sums it up. once you dig thru the history of musicians and artists, you'll find that most of them are either crazy, depressed, addicts, or sick fucks. you can personally ban music/movies/art from that particular person, but the world will continue to rock on. lets take james brown. so, if we ban jb, does that mean we also have to ban every artist that sampled his music? That one move practically eradicated a whole genre of music. the work that these people have done is part of history. part of movements and eras. you can't erase it. you have to separate the two....................... i still feel some type of way about Milli Vanilli though. that was just plain despicable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danswift Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 I dunno, I sound accusatory, but I have music I love by murderers, rapists, wife beaters, pimps and so forth. On the whole I think the art should be detached, if only because there would be a lot of good music gone forever. But then again I still bin the Gary Glitter records that turn up in collections, so maybe Im as bad as anyone else? This got me thinking about artists I like who were or are total cunts generally and Leadbelly springs immediately to mind..he was a nasty son of a bitch but I have all the time in the world for his music which my Dad played to me growing up. I think you'd find flaws with a large percentage of musicians if their personal lives were thrust under a microscope..the vast majority I've met in the past have been assholes generally, but there's been some cool, exceptional people too. Talking of MJ I've never understood the infatuation thing that goes along with a lot of the followers of Michael Jackson or their blind refusal to accept the notion that he just may have abused those kids after all. I also never truly got the appeal of his music to the levels it attained at it's peak..I mean,I do think that 'Off The Wall' is a pretty decent album but I never got the appeal of Thriller at all..I know im probably in the minority here but I always thought it was naff as fuck and the hype surrounding it all was ridiculous, even as a teenager. I also reckon Jackson was always strange to begin with, and of course, you've got to look into his upbringing too which was anything but conventional,the pressures put on Michael Jackson that he underwent as a child working in the music business must have been extraordinary to say the least. There are also rumours that Jackson was possibly chemically castrated as a child in order to 'preserve' his voice as he aged..I don't know if it's true and I highly doubt we'll ever know but if it is true then its horrific. I think the astronomical level of success he achieved allowed him to indulge in weird behaviour as wherever there's a cash cow driving a gravy train the type of sycophants who surround artists like MJ always seem to look the other way when it comes to those artists indiscretions plus having that level of fame probably pushed his sanity over the edge completely in the end and the circumstances surrounding his death are a very sad and shoddy state of affairs as we all know. On a lighter note,Barry White was once arrested and charged with stealing $30,000 worth of tyres! He got four months lol.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHouse Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Sadly, there's seemingly an inverted relationship between successful musicians and sickening monstrous acts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djdiggla Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 ^^^This. I've been asking myself this question a lot. Particularly with the silence R Kelly stuff. Personally, I try and just enjoy the music separated from the person. So many musicians are/were pieces of shit. And some we laud because of that even (often in rap especially). It's tough though... I'm not trying to give a monster more power and likewise not aiming to be edgy or offensive at a gig... but seriously... who are our champions even? I can hardly think of any. To go off on a tangent, I've thought about this similarly with American football. A lot of players are domestic abusers. The league has come down really hard on this and I'm torn... of course I don't support domestic abuse but isn't that a criminal matter that should be handled by the courts? Kicking someone out of the league and depriving them of a job isn't justice (or is it?)... I'm really uncomfortable with work and personal lives being so tied. So to circle back to the original question it's similar for me... Am I a bad person for liking and listening to Tempo by Chris Brown since he's a domestic abuser? IDK. But I don't think so. There really isn't a good answer in my mind. Or at least if there is I'm still grappling with it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shimmer Posted April 9, 2019 Share Posted April 9, 2019 Yah, depends on the misdeeds. My fav artist is Vybz Kartel. He’s locked up 8+ years now for masterminding a murder. His songs were always drenched in gansterism, so I still regard him as I have from the start. It’s very difficult to discern the truth when it comes to what is published in media. Some artists and people are legitimate victims of high-level smear campaigns. Jacko and Kells seem well dodge though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted April 10, 2019 Author Share Posted April 10, 2019 For me, it doesn't make any difference to how much I enjoy music. It does make a difference when it comes to what I spend my money on, but I guess I'm not even consistent with that and I don't know where I would draw the line. If I had to purge my collection of all music created by people who've either been convicted or accused of murder, sex offences, dealing hard drugs like crack/heroin, beating women, or other acts of extreme violence, I would probably have to delete a lot of shit. I know I would, and if I really looked into it, I'd discover even more awful shit that I'm not even aware of - I didn't even know about MC Tee until I read Broke's post and Googled the situation. I feel repulsed by the actions of certain artists, but at the same time, I can completely disconnect that from the work they've produced when it comes to my own personal enjoyment of it. I don't know why that is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHouse Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 At the end of the day, errrybody's fucked up. We're all animals trying the do the best we can while navigating drugs, alcohol, kestrels, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 kestrels LOL Am I a bad person for liking and listening to Tempo by Chris Brown Yes 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Rock Well Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 Some good points here! No grown man should ever entertain the music of Chris Brown. Steve, I agree. Liking the music and directly financing an artist are two different things. Dan - good point with Leadbelly, a twice convicted murderer no less! He wasnt alone either, Skip James for instance openly claimed to have killed two people and many other old blues men had similar pasts. Funnily enough, Leadbelly was very much forgiven later in life when he slotted nearly into the subsequent so-called Folk Blues Revival... unlike James who was pretty universally hated all times in his life. The possible argument in favour of guys like them though was that back in those days, black people in the South didnt have any real policing outside of black on white crime. Im sure there were some bad people involved, but no doubt some people killed to prevent their own demise. Then you get into the whole murky world of diminished responsibility and who knows where that ends? In a funny way, even the NFL issues are now being potentially excused by being linked to all the head trauma (American) football players endure. No clue myself. Some people just arent that nice - Greg Hardys UFC debut comes to mind. Sure, he mightve just been a bit green and made a mistake but it sure looked like he couldnt win or control himself that scenario. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Symatic Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 does it translate to people who fall from grace in real life too? if a relative or a close friend went to prison for murder or rape, would the best response be to disown them? what if they were a relative AND famous? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TBearOne8III Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 does it translate to people who fall from grace in real life too? if a relative or a close friend went to prison for murder or rape, would the best response be to disown them? what if they were a relative AND famous? not really. i got a cousin thats locked up for murder. he's no monster. dumb story actually. drug deal gone bad. there actually were no drugs. my cousin was going to take dudes money and run. dude pulled a pistol, it went off. cousin shot back but did not miss. later he found out that the other guys gun was actually an co2 pellet gun. we never disowned him. he actually gets to call me from time to time. and its great to hear from him. hes my favorite cousin, we used to live together when we were kids. he is guilty of making bad decisions, but he is no monster. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHouse Posted April 10, 2019 Share Posted April 10, 2019 No grown man should ever entertain the music of Chris Brown.Worthy of warning points. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest broke Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 No grown man should ever entertain the music of Chris Brown.Worthy of warning points. Back in my day that'd be worthy of a ban 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted April 11, 2019 Author Share Posted April 11, 2019 does it translate to people who fall from grace in real life too? if a relative or a close friend went to prison for murder or rape, would the best response be to disown them? what if they were a relative AND famous? I couldn't remain friends with a rapist. With murder, it would depend on the circumstances, not that I think anyone should be taking the law into their own hands - and especially not to such extremes - but I would have to look at the overall situation. If I had a friend who was a famous artist who made music that I love, would I stop listening to it if they committed rape or murder? I think I probably would, because when you're connected to someone who does something like that, you feel a sense of betrayal that you don't feel when it's someone that you've never met. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medinah_nitro Posted April 11, 2019 Share Posted April 11, 2019 A lot of cunts make good music A lot of nice people make shit music Id rather be friends with the nice people and listen to the cunts than vice versa 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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