Mistakes all beginners make learning to scratch

[danswift]

Only practicing Ahhh's with a badly cue burnt copy of Hee-Haw Brayks...

[Guest petesasqwax]

Only practicing Ahhh's with a badly cue burnt copy of Hee-Haw Brayks...

That's not a mistake, that's law!

[kebzer]

Errrrybody abandoning 1-click flares for 2-click orbits, only because they sound "faster".

 

Errrybody quiting on double time chirps, only because they sound "too old school for that much of a hassle".

 

The lack of skill on these two basics is hilarious.

[Jam Burglar]

I cut weak hand on the record too and I'm kind of 60/40 on that issue. It completely makes sense that there's more potential for nuance in the dominant hand on the wax but there are also things I've learned that I don't think I would have learned otherwise if I (still) cut dominant hand on the record. I still don't think there's a "right" or "wrong" answer, but that being said I DO lean slightly towards cutting with your dominant hand on the record.

 

Agree with Kebzer on people getting locked into trends. There are a ton of really good scratchers out there who have insane technical skill but can't stand out because they sound just like the 30 or 40 other DJs. There might be 30, 40, 50 DJs all busting the same type of styles and but only 2 or 3 of them end up getting noticed. You have to do something to set yourself apart.

 

One of the things I that think gets overlooked is that when you focus too hard on "patterns" you aren't learning how to express yourself on the cut. There were times when I asked D-Styles about certain things he was doing and he'd be like "I honestly don't know, I'm just making the sounds how I want them to sound". I mean, you HAVE to learn patterns, but I feel like I'm at my best when I forget about all that, try to make the sounds in my head, and let the techniques go on autopilot. For me there's a point where skills and crazy complicated patterns top out and style becomes a lot more important. Do you want to be the most technical scratcher in the world, or do you want to express yourself and make music? I rank Premier on Code of the Streets above a ton of stuff that's more advanced and solid on a technical level.

 

Agree on the different beats/tempos thing. A good way to separate out the wheat from the chaff in a session is to throw on a weird beat and see who can hang and who falls off. There are tons of cats who are crazy sick but only over certain tempos.

 

All in all I think the best advice I can think of is "be different". I don't know what happened in hip hop but that used to be rule #1.

[Guest broke]

I cut weak hand on the record too and I'm kind of 60/40 on that issue.

I started with my better hand on the record and switched when I was trying to learn flares.

 

For me, I find it easier learning record control (and finesse) with my weak hand than learning complicated click patterns with my weak hand.

 

I've tried learning a few things on both sides but it's kinda pointless IMO.

[Mista_Ed]

 

• Practicing over DJ Premier-esque instrumentals instead of sparse tracks that allow your cuts to stand out.
• Chirping everything instead of incorporating babies and dices.

 

 

THATS where i went wrong......dammit. lol

[Jam Burglar]

 

I cut weak hand on the record too and I'm kind of 60/40 on that issue.

I started with my better hand on the record and switched when I was trying to learn flares.

 

For me, I find it easier learning record control (and finesse) with my weak hand than learning complicated click patterns with my weak hand.

 

I've tried learning a few things on both sides but it's kinda pointless IMO.

 

 

I did the same thing but it was the transforming for me if I remember right. I had probably been DJing for 4 years or so. At that time everybody was saying cut with your dominant hand on the fader. I think it was just the path of least resistance in my case.

[Guest Symatic]

i put in a half our or so of practice last nihgt on my weak side.

 

I cut with my dominant hand on fader. It's always bugged me that I learned that way. I know why though. it's cos I started out not even tihnking about it - both hands seemed like a obvious thing to learn with, but my mixer was a broken gemini scratchmaster, and the fader wasnt for cutting with. the transform switches were both broken so i started transforming with the line switch. I'd never even heard of hamster style so naturally i ended up cutting with the sound coming ON in the direction of the turntable the audio wsa coming from. this meant I ended up cutting with left hand on record and the right hand on the switch.

Later when I got a Technics mixer that had the line switch rotated on the Right side to enable that natural feel, I had already been turned to the dark side.

 

So last night I really tried to push through the 5 minute zone that i always hit when trying to cut the opposite side, where i normally give up. I spent a while just focusing on basics, tihnking back to this thread, and it really helped. Im not GOOD on that side, but it made a big difference to my approach and i can see that becoming a regular training excercise now.

 

It even tought me stuff about how i could improve my regular side, highlighting inefficiencies and bad habits.

 

I noticed my record hand with my dominant hand on record, had so much scope for extra expression and control. but right now my fader hand feels so useless and weak - its like scratching with 5 pinkies!

 

[mfsop]

Even though I rarely scratch nowadays, I think you're onto something. I never managed to get those bumby knuckles flicks right (I use my non-dominant hand on the record). With the dominant hand, it was way better right from the start. I believe there's a lot of value in A/B-ing your hands and trying to copy what the better hand does better (like angles of the wrist and fingers, position on the record and what not - a mirror helps). It's like having an advanced teacher without needing another person.

I once read about a study that professional pianists don't necessarily have faster fingers and stronger muscles than amateurs but mainly better technique. Finding those small differences in how the hands do things can be a bit tedious since you have to slow down a lot to spot them but it can really lead to some light bulb moments.

[joeClockwork]

I still haven't got that knuckle flick technique down.

[Guest Symatic]

Yeah i keep meaning to put more work in on my other hand. Cristian dominguez got me on to it really. He is incredible with both hands. It jut took time and defication.

Bumpy knuckles took me about a year or more to get down and im pretty sure im doing them wrong anyway. The movement kinda felt like it WOULD be better on my other hand but i have not got the coordination at all.

I did notice a big advantage for righties though - the area of the record youre using and the angle you approach it from really feels more comfortable, and your natural stance in the position seems more stable.

 

Sorry this is sort of derailing the thread into advanced stuff i guess - the main thing is that i was trying the other side and felt like a beginner again but its good practice

[Guest It'sPhilFromThursdays]

As an officially qualified ambi-cutter I'd say it's horses for courses. I always cut a bit on the right back in the day cos it was the law that if you wanna battle you'll get called out as a sucker if you couldn't, plus get judged better. I remember Boney Vegas taking the piss out of Prime Cuts for not being able to chirp on both sides and frankly anyone who's into juggling, I've got no idea why you aren't cos you'll be tons better and have loads more options when doing ish.

 

Sy, you should rock my 2 mixer set up if you gonna have a proper go cos if you can't work something out then you can go back to the other side swiftly and then re-apply it to your weak ass hand. Plus it makes you more apt to bust from sided to side than having to reposition yourself on the other side.

 

My advice, after doing a bit of concerted adjustment, is to practice in this set up and do 5 mins on strong and then 7-10 mins on the weak and bounce back and forth for your practice sesh. It's odd how much doing something on one side can flip in you brain if you bounce over and do it straight away. You might lose it after a couple of cuts but it's a good start for getting the muscle memory.

 

I've been cutting properly as part of practice for about 6 years on the right now and can sometimes sound nicer on the right but it's still a little bit like a lump o meat compared the the left (strong) hand. My fine finger control was noticeably decent to start with though and still are cos of the fader tapping. Obv. i could do woodpeckers and ish i couldn't on my left til now. Was hard working out the one handed forward hydros though.

 

Anyway, that may or may not be good advice for everyone but worked for me and is some stuff i noticed.

 

I learned my bumping knucks just by really methodically doing them > Raise knucks, slide forward fingers til hand is flat, reset to raised knuck, slide fingys forward til hand is flat. Reverse, raise knucks to pull record back with fingys, flatten hand, etc, etc reeeeallly slowly. Again cos of my fingies i could do then almost straight away on the right.

 

Anyway to not derail das thread too much here's a good one i don't think anyone has said:

 

Pushing the record really fucking hard and pushing down too hard out of desperately trying to control the record (maybe more of a problem when we were all at 33 1/3) aaaaaand slapping the fader about really hard. The best early advice i got was from Skratch Uk when i phoned up to order new fader and they were all "you've only had that a year wtf, you don't need to crab hard, you don't need to tap the fader hard, save your energy". The gentler you are the more energy you'll save too.

[medinah_nitro]

I just hit walls theres certain patterns I have on lock but I get stuck in the same routine and cant snap out

[Flexinoodle]

Not doing enough drugs, scratching on Acid sorts your life out

[danswift]

Not doing enough drugs, scratching on Acid sorts your life out

Flol.

 

This is possibly the best comment I've ever read in my life ..

[mfsop]

As an officially qualified ambi-cutter I'd say it's horses for courses. I always cut a bit on the right back in the day cos it was the law that if you wanna battle you'll get called out as a sucker if you couldn't, plus get judged better. I remember Boney Vegas taking the piss out of Prime Cuts for not being able to chirp on both sides and frankly anyone who's into juggling, I've got no idea why you aren't cos you'll be tons better and have loads more options when doing ish.

Oh yeah, not learning any basic beat juggling should be on the list of mistakes. Looping two or four bars with some baby scratches and forwards helped me so much with mixing, too. In the beginning it was kind of hard to just spin the record back with my fader hand.

Also, beat juggling sounds terrible when it's not done right. First time trying these patterns by P-Trix at 1:20 was a bit embarrasing..

 

More derailment:

I learned my bumping knucks just by really methodically doing them > Raise knucks, slide forward fingers til hand is flat, reset to raised knuck, slide fingys forward til hand is flat. Reverse, raise knucks to pull record back with fingys, flatten hand, etc, etc reeeeallly slowly. Again cos of my fingies i could do then almost straight away on the right.

Thanks, seems like I've tried something else then but I can't remember where I got from.. I always thought that you split the movement up to decrease the load on the hand. I start the forward and backward mostly with the wrist and half way through the record movement, I 'click' with my thumb against the fingers.

 

[Guest Symatic]

dat p trix vid tho. who could fuck with that even now?

[Guest It'sPhilFromThursdays]

I know right! He was always one the ultimate ultra bosses of juggling.

 

I learned my bumping knucks just by really methodically doing them > Raise knucks, slide forward fingers til hand is flat, reset to raised knuck, slide fingys forward til hand is flat. Reverse, raise knucks to pull record back with fingys, flatten hand, etc, etc reeeeallly slowly. Again cos of my fingies i could do then almost straight away on the right.

Thanks, seems like I've tried something else then but I can't remember where I got from.. I always thought that you split the movement up to decrease the load on the hand. I start the forward and backward mostly with the wrist and half way through the record movement, I 'click' with my thumb against the fingers.

 

 

 

Hey, this isn't wrong tho as you are basically are making your hand do the same movement, but you do have to be careful that you don't make your hand be doing a scribbley baby which you can do with the old slapping the thumb technique. You can minimise the thumb movement (and save the energy) and still be doing the same movement.

In what i explained, yes, start moving your hand forward as you start too, i kinda explained how i learned in a basic way there, the wrist is still involved or it would defy human physiology .

I believe it was good old EricUK would taught that method and he was patient zero for most of us at SSS for bumpy knucks and we call them that cos of him too cos lots of folks called them wave tears i believe.

[chile]

being too conformist and not making any mistakes

[Mike-L]

I started cutting on both sides at the outset because i learned from listening to tapes and records and assumed thats what you do. By the time I started watching videos I was already transforming with my weak hand. Thats now my preferred way of doing things, but most patterns I can do with both hands with some differences at the extremes.

 

Phil - I do the two mixer set up too, definitely recommend. Are you sure the Tony Vegas & Prime Cuts story is not the other way round? - PC is pretty amidextrous on that old scratch battle vs A-Train as far as I can remember.

 

I wished Id had started sit down scratch sessions much earlier. So much more relaxing for extended practice sessions. The perfect height stool is a must have.

[Guest It'sPhilFromThursdays]

^^ Hah, i think i nicked the idea for constantly using the two mixer set up from you in fact, so cheers.

 

It defo was Boney, he wasn't saying that he couldn't cut on both sides he just thought it was super funny he couldn't chirp on one side. That was about 2001 i think (maybe 2000).

 

Here's one: Warm up and warm down you young supple muscled turks, your muscles will be old and hoary one day!!!