Mad turntablist Inventions

[Steve]

I really do think that scratching peaked at the end of the 90's.

 

I disagree with that. Scratching is something that people have been doing for about 30 years. No way has it peaked. Not even close. It's stale as fuck though now I agree. My friend Craig is really good at scratching, but he'd never heard of D-Styles. I think scratching has no decent people representing it. You've either got Q who's doing the same old shit to earn 10 grand an hour (fair play!), or people like Ricci who are too arrogant and put people off. You and Ryan are the best two scratchers on this board no question, but what are you guys doing? I dunno - I kind of hope one of you is gonna blind us with a mad album or something.

 

There are still thousands of DJs out there that don't even understand making music with scratching. On DJForums, one of the mods asked me how you made drums with scratching, so I posted a really short file of how you could scratch a bass and snare, then add cymbals, then add cuts. He said "I'm amazed how you scratch all those things at once", clearly missing the point. It's still a total mystery to some people man. Once people understand, there will be good shit appearing - I'm totally sure of that.

[Huw]

i agree, stuff is pretty stale, and by and large the 'scratch music' that comes out sounds like basic, average-at-best music that people rave over because it's 'all-scratched'. people are too concerned over making stuff technical rahter than melodic and musical. i'd rather listen to a piece of simpole, funky as fuck music, than an all-scratched, over complicated piece of shit made by some cunt that thinks he's the next fucking mozart, when in actual fact he has no concept of musicality...

[Steve]

There's no market for it though cos every genre needs it's big names. Scratching has none. Turntables are outselling guitars, but the Ruck needs to sell 100 "package deals" so he can even afford to press extra records. It's a bit sad considering he is the top man in the scene - like it or not.

[Huw]

haha, nah, he ain;t the top man. he's the third, second at best most noticable figure on the internet scene, and that is purely because of his vocality (is that even a word?!), behind q and d. in the 'real world', more people have heard of and prefer people like excess, toadstyle, d, q, imerge etc etc. and for a man that has supposedly put out the 2 best albums ever, that's saying quite a lot. he has about 1000 fans, of which 98% are on the net...

[Steve]

Qbert's last album was years ago, so was D's. I don't like Ricci Rucker, anyone knows that, but he's constantly doing shit and nobody else is. In a certain respect he has his corner of the market on lock down because there is no competition.

[Huw]

but is there a market? apart from his 'net fans, does he sell to anyone else? have you ever seen a rucker record in your local record store? thought not. he may have the market on lock, but there's not really much of a market to have on lock, at least at the moment. if you ask a majorty of scratchers what they think is a scratch album, they'd sa hiphop beats with power scratching most of the way thru...

[Steve]

It's common sense - the turntable out sells the guitar, yet people at the peak of the turntablist scene are struggling to shift units? Something is clearly wrong there. Why is Ricci Rucker not known worldwide? Well that's obvious too - he appeals to a niche audience and plays gigs in front of small audiences. His initital marketing (aliaS_ etc) worked a treat, but now he's moaning that Green Lantern is on the front of magazines and he isn't. The answer is simple - exposure. A little compromising on his part would mean a huge increase in exposure and would probably do the whole scratch scene the world of good.

[djdj]

I can't remember who said it, Edison I think, but:

 

"Invention is 99% persperation and 1% innovation"

 

I don't know if you notice, when you are learning something you go up in steps. You may learn three new scratches in one day, and then no more for months later. You are always developing your skill but it takes time for it to become so ingrained that you take it for granted.

 

Yeah, there may be a lot of sucker DJ's out there just playin' for bucks, or playin' the same scratch over and over, but they are like the pioneers. Leading the way, laying a stable road for the next gen.

 

Don't be a hater man, there is no real gain in dissin' anybodies shit. Let them play and learn from their mistakes. So what if some DJ Kenny G want's to play Ahhh!!! for three hours, I don't have to listen. A true innovator will shine wind rain or fall.

 

pz!

Edited January 17, 2005 by djdj

[Guest Deeswift]

[Steve]

Don't be a hater man, there is no real gain in dissin' anybodies shit. Let them play and learn from their mistakes. So what if some DJ Kenny G want's to play Ahhh!!! for three hours, I don't have to listen. A true innovator will shine wind rain or fall.

 

Yeah, that's true, but then a little education goes a long way. I remember when I heard scratching and didn't know shit about it. There was nobody to tell me how it was done and I made some ridiculous false guesses on how things were achieved. That was years ago though - there's no excuse for anybody not to learn loads, especially if they hang about here.

[Blak Randy]

Thing is though I think the problem is lots of people (Me included) sometimes think the innternet and message boards represent a large chunk of the scratch scene which isn't true. Of all the people I know who scratch less than 10% of them go on message boards. The best 2 scratchers I know don't go online at all. I also know of 2 guys from Newcastle who make the best "scratch music" I have heard by a mile and no one would even know who they are. I know loads of people go on about how they know people who are good blah blah but as far as all scratched down tempo music it pisses all over everything I have heard including the stuff I've heard from everyones favourite djs and the supossed inovators. It's the only stuff I've heard you can put on at work and people who don't evn know what scratching is will come over and ask about it saying they like it. Anyway I have totaly forgot my original point but fuck it I have a massive hangover. Scratching is gay anyway, I'm a start mixing Spanish Trance and Hard House.

[Rick Flarez]

...Post a file?

[Blak Randy]

Cool. I'll get a top quality mix of the hard house and gabba together and post that shit ASAP. Hahaha.

 

Nah can't post a file as they are gonna put out a record really soon so don't want to put ish on the internet.

[Rick Flarez]

Cool! Let us know when it drops will you?

[Guest Mike Reezy]

That's the problem, everything's stale. I really do think that scratching peaked at the end of the 90's.....the last great turntable album I heard was Wave Twisters. D-Styles album didn't do much for me....

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I highly doubt the 90's comment, peeps are doing mad new shit since then.

 

Wavetwisters over Phantaz? Give me some of that crack doo!

 

Phantaz is IMO the epitome of sxratch albums. I love it. Its very dark and creepy. I think D did a great job conveying his feelings through this work. I sware I ilsten to it in its entirety from front to back at least once a day. Often using it as a way to start my day. The shit is so funnky and versatile. I never get tired of it.

 

As for saying Riccs shit sux, w/e its all opinion. But I feel alot of his shit.

 

Have you heard "made of glass and stone" ? its on the Ghostface LP I think. I love that track.

 

Do you like Sketchbook? I surely do. Its mad relaxing.

 

I can give copies of that to people who think sxratching is a waste of time, and they could apprecciate it, and even enjoy it. It breaks the standadr of beep freesh ahhhh.

 

Is there any need for a truly portable turntable? i.e. battery powered. Do you really need to practice cutting on the beach or in the back of  a car? Personally I don't think so.

 

How can you make a turntable with a musical scale instead of numbers? It's totally dependent on the note that's playing when the scale is at 0. As for foot pedals, that's something that was talked about 15 years ago.

 

 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes, I need a portable turntable.But not a QFO, the small 7" one Im building

 

I would use it while doing laundry,watching my kid play outside or at the park, roadtrips/bus rides, and just use it for the take anywhere sxratch shit.

 

QFO is not practical for this because it is so big and so expensive.

 

The musical scale note turntable is based off of records in C tone which would be labeled as 0 in # pitch mode or C in notational pitch mode. I am pretty sure Ricc/D are making this table.

 

but is there a market?  apart from his 'net fans, does he sell to anyone else?  have you ever seen a rucker record in your local record store?  if you ask a majorty of scratchers what they think is a scratch album, they'd sa hiphop beats with power scratching most of the way thru...

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Yes, I see Riccis records at streetlight all the time. Like a box,UPR,UPR2,BLT show vinyl,Sketchbook....im sure thyll get fuga and ghostface too.

 

I think if you asked 90% of informed sxratch dj's what a sxratch album was they'd cite Phantaz as an example, but on the other hand if you ask 90% of the uninformed they are going to cite Wavetwisters.

 

It's common sense - the turntable out sells the guitar, yet people at the peak of the turntablist scene are struggling to shift units? Something is clearly wrong there. Why is Ricci Rucker not known worldwide? Well that's obvious too - he appeals to a niche audience and plays gigs in front of small audiences. His initital marketing (aliaS_ etc) worked a treat, but now he's moaning that Green Lantern is on the front of magazines and he isn't. The answer is simple - exposure. A little compromising on his part would mean a huge increase in exposure and would probably do the whole scratch scene the world of good.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

No doubt, ricc needs to bite the bullet and perform more straight solo sxratching. Thats what peeps want to see. And if Q makes say 5K an hour Sxratching, then why isnt Ricci marketing himself to those same people that want to pay Q that much to kutt for an hour? He can kutt just as good or better, but its his thick headed mentality, that dissallows him from doing this. Its a shame really. Out of all of riccs releases, I cant wait for OAFA.

 

Thing is though I think the problem is lots of people (Me included) sometimes think the innternet and message boards represent a large chunk of the scratch scene which isn't true. Of all the people I know who scratch less than 10% of them go on message boards. The best 2 scratchers I know don't go online at all. I also know of 2 guys from Newcastle who make the best "scratch music" I have heard by a mile and no one would even know who they are. I know loads of people go on about how they know people who are good blah blah but as far as all scratched down tempo music it pisses all over everything I have heard including the stuff I've heard from everyones favourite djs and the supossed inovators. It's the only stuff I've heard you can put on at work and people who don't evn know what scratching is will come over and ask about it saying they like it. Anyway I have totaly forgot my original point but fuck it I have a massive hangover. Scratching is gay anyway, I'm a start mixing Spanish Trance and Hard House.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

All that is true as fuck. There is probably some kid sitting in the middle of Alaska, where he cant even get internet service, and he is way better than anyone else. He may or may not get discovered, but just think, he has never heard all of the same inspirational shit we have, he has never seen a sxratch DVD, he hasnt read "the ever" and every sxratch he does, he dont even have a name for, b ut he will be fucking people up no doubt.

 

Remember Ricci, Theres always somebody whos better than you.......

[Steve]

The musical scale note turntable is based off of records in C tone which would be labeled as 0 in # pitch mode or C in notational pitch mode. I am pretty sure Ricc/D are making this table.

 

So all they are doing is re-labelling the markings next to the pitch. Is that so innovative? You could do that yourself with stickers if you wanted. The foot pedal thing is more interesting, but how is that going to work? It would need to snap to the next note up when you clicked the pedal or something. If it worked on a totally sliding scale as the regular pitch slider does then I don't see how you can get any level of accuracy controlling it with your foot.

 

Wave Twisters was released in 1998. Phantazmagorea was released in 2002 (I think). 4 years is a fucking long time in the scratching world. For 4 years there was no album like Wave Twisters. Of course Phantazmagorea is going to be technically better because people's skills had advanced further. It pisses me off when people diss Wave Twisters. It's like saying "Oh Grandmaster Flash - he's fucking shit at scratching" but without him the whole scene might be totally different. Respect where it's due.

[Mixologist]

Yea i'm sorry, ricci is a sick ass cutter but he's an asshole, and his so called future of turntablism puts me to sleep. The main reason he is considered a famous dj is because of the internet. On top of that only like 5% of people the dj are actually into using forums and such, so it's like a couple of people wanting to kiss his ass, saying he's great and start spreading that shit along to other people. the fact is 60 people at tops show up for Ricci's shows. Qbert can bring hundreds, and even people that aren't DJ's can respect Q and enjoy listening to Q or ayone else for that matter. Not the same for Ricci

[Mixologist]

The musical scale note turntable is based off of records in C tone which would be labeled as 0 in # pitch mode or C in notational pitch mode. I am pretty sure Ricc/D are making this table.

 

That's it? So i would have to use a record that has the pitch of C in order for the markings to be correct? What ever year vestax came out with the pdx-2000, they also came out with a series of vinyl that had all these sound effects and insturments on them, it also had picture of what settings you should have the ultra pitch and fine pitch at to get certain pitch's to me that was a better idea. Also, why would you really need to "mark" the notes on the side of the pitch slider. %100 of the muscians i have played with and known, can tell what pitch a certain sound is, it's easier if it's you're trying to use an instrument sound like say a trumpet, rather then jsut random long continuous tones, but i have a pretty good feeling that, it's going to be used with records that have intruetns recorded on them?

[Rick Flarez]

hating on ricci just feeds his whole steez though. I think he's dope. I'd buy a bunch of his stuff if it came to my local record shop (they had like a box of chocolate but I missed it. How good is it?). I'd go see him live. But people who talk about him a lot to praise him or hate on him are misdirecting energy I think, giving that energy to him. He's a dick but only if you interact with him, a lot of musicians are probably the same.

 

Also, I don't see a huge difference between Wave Twisters and Phantaz, I don't understand why people put phantaz on a pedestal. I understand what you're saying about the feeling of it Mike, but to me the horror steez is not a lot different to the goofy space steez of Wave Twisters.

 

steez.

[Steve]

The only record I wanted was that Ghostface track, but it was $35 and it was only a fucking demo version - not the complete thing. Sod that.

[Guest Mike Reezy]

The musical scale note turntable is based off of records in C tone which would be labeled as 0 in # pitch mode or C in notational pitch mode. I am pretty sure Ricc/D are making this table.

 

So all they are doing is re-labelling the markings next to the pitch. Is that so innovative? You could do that yourself with stickers if you wanted. The foot pedal thing is more interesting, but how is that going to work? It would need to snap to the next note up when you clicked the pedal or something. If it worked on a totally sliding scale as the regular pitch slider does then I don't see how you can get any level of accuracy controlling it with your foot.

 

Wave Twisters was released in 1998. Phantazmagorea was released in 2002 (I think). 4 years is a fucking long time in the scratching world. For 4 years there was no album like Wave Twisters. Of course Phantazmagorea is going to be technically better because people's skills had advanced further. It pisses me off when people diss Wave Twisters. It's like saying "Oh Grandmaster Flash - he's fucking shit at scratching" but without him the whole scene might be totally different. Respect where it's due.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

OK. The notational scale turntable is also a regular turntable in any form, so it is definitely better. It would be completely symmetrical, and have 7 buttons on each side of the table. It would also have regular pitch slider.

 

These buttons would each be programmed with the exact speed increase needed to make a C note into w/e other not you wanted. Note: it is all based of C notes, so u have to use records made for this table.

 

Each button would have 3 modes, normal [1st time you press it], sharp[2nd time pressed] and flat [3rd time pressed]

 

My flip on it is make it all digital so you could set a pitch and then hold down one of the 7 buttons to lock that pitch setting to that buttons. Digital programmable quartz lock?

 

I never dissed Wtwisters. I like it alot. I know it sound for sound, and visually to. Tho I prefer the CD to the DVD. I just dont think it was that innovative. Its just sxratching over beats. Dont get me wrong, but I dont think it was groundbreaking, and as for the video, Q didnt make it, Syd Garon and Eric Henry and the other peoples on their team did. People are suckers for space alienz and tripped out names and shit tho.

 

I also dont understand the foot controlled poitch pedal.

 

]

The only record I wanted was that Ghostface track, but it was $35 and it was only a fucking demo version - not the complete thing. Sod that.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I feel the same way yo. Anybody have it? Let me get a dub of that shit, byut for now Ill be fine with 'made of glass and stone'

 

Also, I don't see a huge difference between Wave Twisters and Phantaz, I don't understand why people put phantaz on a pedestal.  I understand what you're saying about the feeling of it Mike, but to me the horror steez is not a lot different to the goofy space steez of Wave Twisters.

 

steez.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Can you explain how Wave twisters has a 'goofy space' steeze? w/out making a reference to the video?

 

Phantaz was the 1st all sxratched album thats why man! The 1st! and look how good it is! Thats why p33ps be puttin it on a pedestal yo. ANd its not that its 'horror steeze', its just great HIP HOP muzik, but it conveys the crazy mindset of the freak that D is. I mean cmon, he said its about 'cocaine'.

 

Either way both Phantaz and Wtwisters were made on alot of drugs, And one of the songs on Wtwisters is D's song so D wins. HHAHAH JK.

 

I like Phantaz alot better tho, I dont really consider wavetwisters muzik. More of like skratch practice shit. only its orchestrated. oh yea skratch muzik. Only people who like sxratching are going to like it. But mad hiphops heads can apprecciate Phantaz..

[Steve]

The turntable sounds interesting and no doubt it's "going to change the world of scratching FOREVER!", but I don't think I'll be buying one. I might get a CDX at some point though. Whatever happens, it would be good to have one standard deck that everybody came to use.

 

I think Wave Twisters is more than a scratch practice. As for innovation, what other albums were out before 2002 that were anything like it? Which albums have a movie that go with them like that? People on Asis always bang on about D being on it too. So what? They were in the same crew for years. Is the beat on Return To Planetary Deterioration all scratched? I don't think it is. I don't really care either. I think 2tall has the right idea - use what ever you need to make good music. I don't mind if the drums are programmed on some tracks.

 

Wave Twisters, Phantazmagorea and Scetchbook are all very different albums. I dunno why people even need to compare them and say which is the "best". They're all good in one way or another.

[Guest Mike Reezy]

The turntable sounds interesting and no doubt it's "going to change the world of scratching FOREVER!", but I don't think I'll be buying one. I might get a CDX at some point though. Whatever happens, it would be good to have one standard deck that everybody came to use.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I dont think I will be getting one, just because of money reasons. I need a new Video cam first. Then I want some kind of digital solution be it SSL or CDX.

 

I think Wave Twisters is more than a scratch practice. As for innovation, what other albums were out before 2002 that were anything like it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

What about return of the DJ(s)?Anti theft device,Spin psycle,X-pressions, I dunno anything that is all sxratiching.

 

Which albums have a movie that go with them like that?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

What does that have to do with the Muzik? He came up with and made the idea of the movie after he recorded his album. So he wasnt really making it with any concept, but after he did it he said he thought it sounded like some space story shit. He then wanted to make a movie.

 

Syd Garon and Eric Heny made the movie, and DUG1 did the art. They made it, alomg with some other people on there team. Im sure Q only jhad to say "yeajh that looks good. Or just throw some spaced out ideas at them.

 

And the sound on the moive is completely different from the album. They added a ton of shit, and the took some off.

 

People on Asis always bang on about D being on it too. So what? They were in the same crew for years. Is the beat on Return To Planetary Deterioration all scratched? I don't think it is. I don't really care either. I think 2tall has the right idea - use what ever you need to make good music. I don't mind if the drums are programmed on some tracks.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I dont mind it either, but prefer to do it live, that way it can be kept funky fresh ever changing, and especially good for performances, where nobody wants to do the samwe fucking thing for an hour. I mean performance wise, if you use a programmed beat you might as well have an mpc on stage, otherwise do some shit by hand and have soemone do it live.

 

 

Wave Twisters, Phantazmagorea and Scetchbook are all very different albums. I dunno why people even need to compare them and say which is the "best". They're all good in one way or another.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Definitely true.

[Steve]

I'm sure Qbert had more creative input in the movie other than letting other guys draw it all and then saying "Yeah that's good"! I've got the movie and the album - there ain't that much difference between the audio at all. Obviously the movie doesn't have anything to do with the music - the album could exist without the movie, but it's a crazy idea and one that totally enhances things IMO.

 

You're right about the other albums though, but I wouldn't really include the ROTDJ series cos they're compilations.

[Guest Mike Reezy]

I'm sure Qbert had more creative input in the movie other than letting other guys draw it all and then saying "Yeah that's good"! I've got the movie and the album - there ain't that much difference between the audio at all. Obviously the movie doesn't have anything to do with the music - the album could exist without the movie, but it's a crazy idea and one that totally enhances things IMO.

 

You're right about the other albums though, but I wouldn't really include the ROTDJ series cos they're compilations.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Nah, watch the making of the dvd, they will say how it happened, and they say what I said.

 

The 'crazy idea' u r talking about was thought of and implicated after the muzik was made.

 

Check this, if Syd Garon/Eric Henry and their same team that worked on Wtwisters along w/ DUG1, made a sxratch for sxratch syncopated video for Phantaz it would be 10X sicker. all just my opinion however tho .