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I always say chain your FX pedals the same way as you would for a guitar.

 

If you use a Wah pedal like a Crybaby for example always put that in first before anything else and if you're using a delay it will sound better as the last pedal in the chain.

 

Obviously there's no hard and fast rules..do what you like and experiment to your hearts content but I've found the best results for me personally have come about doing things this way.

 

 

As stupid and it is I've never thought that chaining the pedals in a different order would have a different result.

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I always say chain your FX pedals the same way as you would for a guitar.

 

If you use a Wah pedal like a Crybaby for example always put that in first before anything else and if you're using a delay it will sound better as the last pedal in the chain.

 

Obviously there's no hard and fast rules..do what you like and experiment to your hearts content but I've found the best results for me personally have come about doing things this way.

 

 

As stupid and it is I've never thought that chaining the pedals in a different order would have a different result.

 

 

Yeah, can be a pretty big difference.

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I'm no role model when it comes to setting up pedals for production. Usually I'm a tweaker after the fact so having plugins made the most sense on every level. But then came the El Cap, which I thought I was just buying for DJing, except then I heard it and within a couple of months I bought a cheap synth which worked out really well!

 

So far, I've mostly just used my pedals with my synth or samples on the way in to my computer. It's actually been a really good learning experience as I've had to commit on the spot to what I record (I never save synth patches either). I do often record a couple of takes though with different wet/dry signals for options and still use some plugins on top for mix related things or odds and ends I can't be arsed to do 'properly'. I do actually believe in the music of chance - a large amount of sample based beats I've made have just been cobbled out of whatever records I've found that week or month, etc. Shoehorning different disparate sounds together is all part of the fun I reckon. I guess I'm better a bit limited, sometimes I like to see what I can come up with whatever's to hand. If it's not there, it's not being used that day/beat/track. I'm aware that much of the music I like was made this way, just musicians on the clock with the gear available in a specific studio, that day.

 

Not trying to copy Dan or anything :d , but I've just added a new toy to my setup. My dad's old Sony Pro Walkman he never uses! I didn't think it would be that good a tool for production, but I tried it recently and was very pleasantly surprised. Like you JB, I was worrying about recording back and forth from my computer and even considered old digital recorders or similar, but wasn't sure about sapping the life out of sounds. Weirdly, I'm fine shoving it on to tape and totally squashing it. Again, limited tools and all that. Also, I know the tape will add hiss, roll off the highs, make the bass a bit fuller and warmer and generally merge sounds together slightly. Once the rules are on the table I'm happy to work with or around them as required.

 

I work between the studio, my armchair in the living room and a bench in the spare room. So I'm forever moving stuff around, but this we me yesterday...

 

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Nice, I used to record stuff to cassette. Had no clue what I was doing but heard about "bouncing to tape" so I tried it but then figured out they were probably not talking about bouncing to a fucking cassette tape. Haha. Thing is, it does kind of work.

 

What I'm figuring out lately is that I like the sound of things recorded directly by my MPC (there must be some compression going on there.)

 

I've never really had any complaints about chaining effects in a certain order (reverb before delay and that sort of thing) but I always struggle with concepts like adding effects or compression before I record into the MPC or trying to add afterwards. I guess it really doesn't matter as long as it sounds passable.

 

I still have no clue what I'm doing.

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I still have no clue what I'm doing.

It's ok, neither does anyone else- myself included !... :((

 

I've drawn up a quick guide to what I think is the best sounding pedal set up.

 

Which -Wah
Chain-Compression
Of-Overdrive
Effects -Equalisers
Pedals-Pitch
Makes-Modulation
Life-Level
Easier-Echo
:8
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Nice, I used to record stuff to cassette. Had no clue what I was doing but heard about "bouncing to tape" so I tried it but then figured out they were probably not talking about bouncing to a fucking cassette tape. Haha. Thing is, it does kind of work.

 

What I'm figuring out lately is that I like the sound of things recorded directly by my MPC (there must be some compression going on there.)

 

I totally thought the same thing with cassette and was just as surprised when I found it did do more than just add hiss.

 

Yes, all MPCs prior to Numark/InMusic owned models (1000 onwards) had a master output with some compression inherent in the circuit, plus a subtle re-EQing too. All Nukai MPCs come with a software compressor to mimic this which is on in default mode (push this too hard though and it all gets a bit shouty and brittle sounding IMO). This compression and EQ balance dates back to the days when MPCs were specifically designed to be 'drum samplers' and unsurprisingly the output is particularly well set up for making drums sound beefy and cut through a mix. The 60, 60II and 3000 models take it further thanks to the limitations of their bit rate and/or AD/DA conversion. The 2000 and XL are more subtle, but they definitely add goodness - when I switched to software, it took me a while to learn how to make up for this. If you want to get really nerdy, you get less of this effect by recording out of the 8 Outs Board as it was just the master which was set up this way - a bit like a more subtle SSL desk master bus compressor or that sort of thing.

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Where's your reverb and fuzz Dan?!

I never use reverb tbh and especially not the synthetic type you find on modern hardware FX units..they just sound wrong to my ears.The only reverb I would want to use is from an amplifier with a proper spring reverb built in, a Fender Twin preferably!

 

I've had all manner of overdrive,fuzz and distortion pedals over the years ,the old Dallas Arbiter fuzz face units were bloody marvellous I've got to say,although you'd have to pay a small fortune for an original nowadays.

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I did have a Boss Digital reverb pedal a few years ago but I never used it for reverb,just the loop function which was brilliant,that and the MXR Phase 90 used with a Dunlop Crybaby,Digitech Whammy and a Boss Digital Delay-the lovely silver ones,was probably my all time favourite set up that I had.

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Nice, I used to record stuff to cassette. Had no clue what I was doing but heard about "bouncing to tape" so I tried it but then figured out they were probably not talking about bouncing to a fucking cassette tape. Haha. Thing is, it does kind of work.

 

What I'm figuring out lately is that I like the sound of things recorded directly by my MPC (there must be some compression going on there.)

 

I totally thought the same thing with cassette and was just as surprised when I found it did do more than just add hiss.

 

Yes, all MPCs prior to Numark/InMusic owned models (1000 onwards) had a master output with some compression inherent in the circuit, plus a subtle re-EQing too. All Nukai MPCs come with a software compressor to mimic this which is on in default mode (push this too hard though and it all gets a bit shouty and brittle sounding IMO). This compression and EQ balance dates back to the days when MPCs were specifically designed to be 'drum samplers' and unsurprisingly the output is particularly well set up for making drums sound beefy and cut through a mix. The 60, 60II and 3000 models take it further thanks to the limitations of their bit rate and/or AD/DA conversion. The 2000 and XL are more subtle, but they definitely add goodness - when I switched to software, it took me a while to learn how to make up for this. If you want to get really nerdy, you get less of this effect by recording out of the 8 Outs Board as it was just the master which was set up this way - a bit like a more subtle SSL desk master bus compressor or that sort of thing.

 

 

That's really good to know! I only have a 2000xl so no true compression for me but yeah, sounds like I'm still seeing some through the software. I've got the 8 outs but don't have a mixing board or soundcard to properly utilize them so they're dormant for now. That's good to know whenever I get good soundcard or mixer though.

 

If I want to record out of the MPC track by track I just solo the track I want in the MPC and record each track separately onto the computer. I'll usually put a dummy sequence at the beginning of the song with one high-hat on each track. Then after I record all my separate tracks to the computer I can line them up using that high hat. I'm surprised I don't see the tracks drifting using this method but it seems to work. This allows me to run the individual tracks through a compressor, or effects pedal, or whathaveyou on the way to the computer. And I can do both a wet and dry recording of any track. Something seems totally backwards about this but I can't think of a better way to do it. I sometimes think about running drums through the compressor on the way from the turntable into the MPC (or computer if I record through my soundcard) but it's kind of hard to monitor a 3 second drum snippet to get the compressor settings right.

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No, the 2000 XL very definitely does have the circuitry with some kind of master buss compression, its the 1000, 2500, 500 and 5000 that dont - sorry, shouldve been clearer.

 

That was my first MPC and what I learnt the basics of making beats on.

 

I never had the 8-out on mine and then I read an article with Timbalands sound engineer and they explained the differences between the outputs and why many artists would be happy with their beats straight out the MPC master and would get to the studio and track out of the 8 outs to save time and wonder why it didnt sound right. As such, they always took the time to solo every single track out there he master in their studio.

 

Another good thing I saw about the sound qualities of the 2000XL was a Future Music video with these two techno producers. They had all the hardware drum machines you can think of but found the inconvenience of hooking them all up or working in different studios was becoming a headache. They tried recording them into a computer but didnt like the workflow. Then they tried a MPC 3000 because a lot of heads rate them as the best MPC, but found the AD conversion and early 16 bit really changed the drum machine sounds too much. Then they tried the 2000XL and loved it. As they said, it keeps the original sound intact and just enhances it a little in ways they always wouldve in the mix down anyway. I have to agree, theres nothing it doesnt do, particularly to drums, that Id want to undo.

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I did have a Boss Digital reverb pedal a few years ago but I never used it for reverb,just the loop function which was brilliant,that and the MXR Phase 90 used with a Dunlop Crybaby,Digitech Whammy and a Boss Digital Delay-the lovely silver ones,was probably my all time favourite set up that I had.

In my previous defence of reverb I was very much thinking in terms of general music production and synths, rather than the more obvious application for guitar pedals that is guitars. It funny because certain effects combined with specific instruments can be much more divisive. For instance, digital reverb and chorus on electric guitar is very 80s and usually a bit cringeworthy (80s funk being the exception... for me at least). Generally with electric guitar, I agree with your earlier sentiment - real spring or nothing.

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Guest Psychedelic Schizophrenic

Numark/InMusic owned models (1000 onwards)

 

A little tip from me if you using either a 1000 or 2500 with JJOS then just bypass the outputs completely. I rarely track out any of my battle beats on the 2500 as I've found that if I use song mode and mixdown in the machine it sounds sightly warmer then tracking out if you bypass the outputs. I now just use the inbuilt mixer to master my beats, even the inbuilt EQ and Compression sounds a little beefier and warmer if you bypass using any of the outputs too.

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In my previous defence of reverb I was very much thinking in terms of general music production and synths, rather than the more obvious application for guitar pedals that is guitars. It funny because certain effects combined with specific instruments can be much more divisive.

 

I often wonder if stompboxes specifically designed for bass guitars would work well with synths,especially on the low end frequencies..I've only ever used guitar pedals on the synths I've owned but theres tons of cool pedals for the bass that would be nice to mess around on and experiment with.

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Yep, had the exact same thought Dan! Not sure how it would affect things. Although a lot of bass guitar effects boast that they handle the output volume and and impedence (who knows?) of bass guitar pickups, which Ive not found to be a problem with a synth yet. Also, they often boast about only effecting the higher frequencies and leaving the bass intact. I can totally see the benefits of this for live play, but as I use them mostly to make my own samples its not a problem if it messes up the bottom end, I just high pass it and replace the bass with a clean low passed sub.

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Guest petesasqwax

I often wonder if stompboxes specifically designed for bass guitars would work well with synths,especially on the low end frequencies..I've only ever used guitar pedals on the synths I've owned but theres tons of cool pedals for the bass that would be nice to mess around on and experiment with.

This is actually why I got my Fuzz War - because Ty Segall etc used it on bass and I loved how it sounded. When I put the synths through it it sounded amazing... but I had no ability to be restrained and ultimately had to sell it to avoid everything sounding like variations of modulated gristle

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If youre on this forum and you sold me this Rodec, kill yourself and learn how to package something

 

 

 

Jesus Christ on a pogo stick! This is a common issue in the arcade world too. You have this rare, delicate electronic equipment and for some reason people think they can just throw it in a box with no padding and it will magically arrive. It's not rocket science, all you need to do is use some bubble wrap and newspapers.

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